Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 18th, 2012, 11:46 am

vette-ss wrote:Another vote for Rec Pass on every vehicle I own but still use the JC Penny inlet for a convenience factor (it is much quicker access, depending on which direction you are coming from). I guess I'm also not up to speed on the inner workings of invasive plant species, but how does a trail through the woods promote growth, or why is this caused by the trail? Where are the invasive plants coming from, other MI woodlands? Why is this only a problem on the connector and not all of blue and yellow? Inquiring minds want to know.


The trail doesn't have anything to do with the growth or spread of the invasive species. I just mentioned that it was volunteers helping with this problem that alerted the DNR about some new trails being cut in a potentially restricted area.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby Loren » June 18th, 2012, 11:54 am

Some trail users have been shown to spread invasive species, but not hikers or bikers...
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 18th, 2012, 12:04 pm

Loren wrote:Some trail users have been shown to spread invasive species, but not hikers or bikers...



I’ve gotten some of this on my tires and MAY have unwittingly spread these plants! :oops:
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby G.Cook » June 18th, 2012, 2:52 pm

I have volunteered with the DNR Park Stewardship crew and have never worked that area clearing invasive. It might be considered a sensitive area as the Stewardship Unit might have it designated as a Oak Sand Prairie . The TC should talk to this DNR staffer to get the real picture of that area;

Laurel Malvitz-Draper

Natural Resource Steward

Stewardship Unit, Parks and Recreation Division

Michigan Department of Natural Resources



web: http://www.michigan.gov/dnrvolunteers

email: malvitzl@michigan.gov

phone: 248-359-9057

fax: 248-355-2669
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 18th, 2012, 9:43 pm

G.Cook wrote:I have volunteered with the DNR Park Stewardship crew and have never worked that area clearing invasive. It might be considered a sensitive area as the Stewardship Unit might have it designated as a Oak Sand Prairie . The TC should talk to this DNR staffer to get the real picture of that area;

Laurel Malvitz-Draper

Natural Resource Steward

Stewardship Unit, Parks and Recreation Division

Michigan Department of Natural Resources



web: http://www.michigan.gov/dnrvolunteers

email: malvitzl@michigan.gov

phone: 248-359-9057

fax: 248-355-2669


Thanks G.Cook,

Volunteers brought this issue up to Laurel, who then alerted the ILRA Unit Manager, who in turn contacted me. I hope to get a bit more clarification with ILRA staff this week.

I did however finally look over the area. The Kiosk and trailhead are a Green Oak Shopping center thing, and not official DNR issue. The trails cited as new do not look new to me and they look less traveled.

I'm pretty sure this will all blow over as I do not see them shutting down bike access. As for the other "new" trails??? We wouldn't want to ride on them anyway.

I'll post up after I speak with the park Manager.

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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 18th, 2012, 9:49 pm

Just did a historical Google Earth search of that area. "The new trail" was very well defined back in 1992. :roll:
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby G.Cook » June 18th, 2012, 11:31 pm

So some "volunteers" who "maybe" involved with the stewardship volunteer crew complained to the ILRA land mgr. about this trail that has been there since 92 ? Yeah, I would get a hold of Laurel and perhaps put this BS out of it's misery asap. And if they are stewardship crew volunteers I personally think they are over stepping themselves in their complaint. If their is a complaint about this situation it would come from the DNR Stewardship supervisors to the land mgr.
I have volunteered with mostly the Pinckney Rec. crew and occasionally with the ILRA and Brighton crew for the last 4-5 years and this situation seems a little "off" to me in the way it is being handled. The trail would have to be in quality area for the stewardship unit to raise a complaint and that would be unusual unless the trail is a new one , which this isn't . They don't say crap about the trails running through those areas at Pinckney so why ILRA ?
Please talk to Laurel. I would not be surprised if she would be some what mystified about the situation.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 19th, 2012, 6:41 am

G.Cook wrote:So some "volunteers" who "maybe" involved with the stewardship volunteer crew complained to the ILRA land mgr. about this trail that has been there since 92 ? Yeah, I would get a hold of Laurel and perhaps put this BS out of it's misery asap. And if they are stewardship crew volunteers I personally think they are over stepping themselves in their complaint. If their is a complaint about this situation it would come from the DNR Stewardship supervisors to the land mgr.
I have volunteered with mostly the Pinckney Rec. crew and occasionally with the ILRA and Brighton crew for the last 4-5 years and this situation seems a little "off" to me in the way it is being handled. The trail would have to be in quality area for the stewardship unit to raise a complaint and that would be unusual unless the trail is a new one , which this isn't . They don't say crap about the trails running through those areas at Pinckney so why ILRA ?
Please talk to Laurel. I would not be surprised if she would be some what mystified about the situation.


No. The volunteers contacted Laurel, who contacted the park manager, who then contacted me.

My original post was me acting on what the park manager asked me to do because we thought someone was cutting new trails. This has turned out not to be the case which is good. I don't think it will end up being a big deal.

I've been unable to reach the park manager but should be able to today. I don't foresee any more problems as this entrance has been used for years, that is as long as just the original trail is used.

Laurel has been included in all the correspondence with the park so far, but I'll also do as you suggest and contact her as well.

For anyone looking to have an active involvement with the park, there is a friends of Island Lake group forming. Their first meeting is Saturday 6/23 https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=gmail&attid=0.1&thid=13800f2d5e189724&mt=application/msword&authuser=0&url=https://mail.google.com/mail/u/0/?ui%3D2%26ik%3Da6ce6d8c9c%26view%3Datt%26th%3D13800f2d5e189724%26attid%3D0.1%26disp%3Dsafe%26realattid%3D10b011c3ab275abb_0.1%26zw&sig=AHIEtbTTfFefXGRO8hXPJ0d895eCRlLOWQ

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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby G.Cook » June 19th, 2012, 7:56 am

:shock: :roll: Well at least the volunteers went through "channels". :lol:
Should be an interesting conversation the next volunteer session at Pinckney Rec. I attend. Hopefully she will contact the IMBA TC next time to find out whats really going on with a trail system in any of the parks . Glad your going to talk to her as she is really one of the "good guys" with the DNR.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby egraetze » June 19th, 2012, 10:46 am

Are they going to put up a chain link fence to prevent entry from JCP (e.g. Trout Lake fortress). I have 5 cars with the DNR pass including one motorcycle, so lost revenue from me is not an issue. I also pay my MMBA dues. The JCP lot is closer to home, and also allows me to stay away from the park road that road riders believe they own. Lastly, the park management should be more concerned with the white trash taking over Spring Mill Pond that has driven families and others away.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 19th, 2012, 11:51 am

egraetze wrote:Are they going to put up a chain link fence to prevent entry from JCP (e.g. Trout Lake fortress). I have 5 cars with the DNR pass including one motorcycle, so lost revenue from me is not an issue. I also pay my MMBA dues. The JCP lot is closer to home, and also allows me to stay away from the park road that road riders believe they own. Lastly, the park management should be more concerned with the white trash taking over Spring Mill Pond that has driven families and others away.
Eric Graetzel


At this point no. If you do come in from JC Penney PLEASE just stay on the main trail connecting to Blue. I've now come to understand that there are trails also go out to a park and ride in the area. I'd sure like to see those go away but not sure of the feasibility of that?

I spoke with park management and Laurel Malvitz-Draper about all of this. I think if we stay on the one trail maintaining a light impact all should be well.
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Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby Redstone Liger » June 20th, 2012, 5:40 am

The trail leading to the park and ride and the JC Penney trail are one and the same. The penney entrance just short cuts it. The DNR even put a no shooting sign right at the entrance next to the trail. The entrance at the park and ride was there before there was a penneys, before that entire mall was a gleam in it's poppa's eyes.
Seems like closing the entrance from private land would make more sense than closing the totally public/park entrance that the park and ride offers. Pennys could theoretically close it down at their whim especially if they tire of mb'ers in their lot.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 20th, 2012, 6:16 am

Redstone Liger wrote:The trail leading to the park and ride and the JC Penney trail are one and the same. The penney entrance just short cuts it. The DNR even put a no shooting sign right at the entrance next to the trail. The entrance at the park and ride was there before there was a penneys, before that entire mall was a gleam in it's poppa's eyes.
Seems like closing the entrance from private land would make more sense than closing the totally public/park entrance that the park and ride offers. Pennys could theoretically close it down at their whim especially if they tire of mb'ers in their lot.


Thanks for the info. I do need to get out there and take a better look as I'm not that familiar with the area. I took a quick run through last Friday. Am I right in saying there seem to be multiple mostly unused trails crisscrossing the area? Could some of these go away without being a problem?

The park considers this "a high quality prairie remnant that volunteers and others have been stewarding for years." They want it protected. Surely we can have some type of compromise that still allows us access and addresses their concerns.

The bottom line is that it is park land and there are no official trails back there. There will most likely be some signage to follow in an attempt to educate and hopefully keep folks out of the areas they should be avoiding.

Thoughts?

Mark D
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby mmba7614 » June 20th, 2012, 6:49 am

fsr1 wrote:
Redstone Liger wrote:The trail leading to the park and ride and the JC Penney trail are one and the same. The penney entrance just short cuts it. The DNR even put a no shooting sign right at the entrance next to the trail. The entrance at the park and ride was there before there was a penneys, before that entire mall was a gleam in it's poppa's eyes.
Seems like closing the entrance from private land would make more sense than closing the totally public/park entrance that the park and ride offers. Pennys could theoretically close it down at their whim especially if they tire of mb'ers in their lot.


Thanks for the info. I do need to get out there and take a better look as I'm not that familiar with the area. I took a quick run through last Friday. Am I right in saying there seem to be multiple mostly unused trails crisscrossing the area? Could some of these go away without being a problem?

The park considers this "a high quality prairie remnant that volunteers and others have been stewarding for years." They want it protected. Surely we can have some type of compromise that still allows us access and addresses their concerns.

The bottom line is that it is park land and there are no official trails back there. There will most likely be some signage to follow in an attempt to educate and hopefully keep folks out of the areas they should be avoiding.

Thoughts?

Mark D


I've seen hikers, bikers, four wheelers and mini bikes out there. One of these users always seem to follow the same path (either to the park and ride or to Penny's), and the other three seem to meander randomly through out the woods. I'll let you guess which is which ... but talking to us about creating more and more rouge trails is, in this case, totally barking up the wrong tree. If the access is closed to bikes, the rate of new tread isn't going to slow.
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Re: Alternate entrance to Island Lake. JC Penney

Postby fsr1 » June 20th, 2012, 7:04 am

mmba7614 wrote:I've seen hikers, bikers, four wheelers and mini bikes out there. One of these users always seem to follow the same path (either to the park and ride or to Penny's), and the other three seem to meander randomly through out the woods. I'll let you guess which is which ... but talking to us about creating more and more rouge trails is, in this case, totally barking up the wrong tree. If the access is closed to bikes, the rate of new tread isn't going to slow.


This makes sense. Don't see this as a threat, but an opportunity. I think the desire is to keep access but respect the parks concerns. This keeps us in good graces with the DNR and other volunteers with different agendas. Keeping up a good relationship with them is key when we have concerns or want to cut more trails. We the mountain bike community may not be responsible for all the usage as you mention, but we still need to address our part.

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