ATV ID Plates

[G.Cook]

No amount of regulation is going to change the fact that people will always do stupid things. The government cant save you from everything, and it shouldnt be expected to. Life isnt always fair. Tough *beep*.

Gee no *beep*.
But govt. in the way of licensing can sure as *beep* help you to get the SOB who tried to run your ass down while you out minding your own effing business on a non-motorized trail . Of course the govt. is saving the ass of said SOB because it's against the law to shoot and kill the scumbag as he drives off .

[Critter7r]

But govt. in the way of licensing can sure as *beep* help you to get the SOB who tried to run your ass down while you out minding your own effing business on a non-motorized trail . Of course the govt. is saving the ass of said SOB because it's against the law to shoot and kill the scumbag as he drives off .

that assumes 2 things: that the SOB in question went to the trouble to get the ATV registered, and 2) that you can get some numbers off of a 5x7 plate that may or may not be covered in mud and/or mounted on a horizontal surface as he's riding away. He's not going to flip you a business card with the license plate number on it as he rides by.

Regardless, the state only wants the vehicles registered for the money. The retribution factor for people that are insulted or injured on the trail is irrelevant to the powers that be.

[dirt]

But govt. in the way of licensing can sure as *beep* help you to get the SOB who tried to run your ass down while you out minding your own effing business on a non-motorized trail . Of course the govt. is saving the ass of said SOB because it's against the law to shoot and kill the scumbag as he drives off .

that assumes 2 things: that the SOB in question went to the trouble to get the ATV registered, and 2) that you can get some numbers off of a 5x7 plate that may or may not be covered in mud and/or mounted on a horizontal surface as he's riding away. He's not going to flip you a business card with the license plate number on it as he rides by.

Regardless, the state only wants the vehicles registered for the money. The retribution factor for people that are insulted or injured on the trail is irrelevant to the powers that be.

Well, as for other things that require registration, if you are found by the DNR to be on trails w/o a sticker, you get nailed with a big fine. This isn't a new problem, and it doesn't require a new solution. You are required, and lack of one results in a big fine.

As for getting the numbers, yeah, perhaps you can't always read the number.. but a partial number w/ make/model would be better the nothing. Not being 100% effective is no reason to trash any idea, because very few ideas are perfect and infallible.

As for the money, much of that money could go back to the trails themselves. One of the reasons that snowmobile registration in Michigan is so successful is because much of the money goes back into the trail system and benefits the snowmobilers.

http://www.msasnow.org/index.php?option ... &Itemid=63

[Critter7r]

thnig is, these vehicle already require registration to ride on public lands. The OP was simply pointing out an article in which the author opined about the need for larger plates so they could be more easily visible. My thought is that would only serve to make the plate more expensive to manufacture than a sticker, be more costly for everyone, and would solve problems for very few.

[dirt]

thnig is, these vehicle already require registration to ride on public lands. The OP was simply pointing out an article in which the author opined about the need for larger plates so they could be more easily visible. My thought is that would only serve to make the plate more expensive to manufacture than a sticker, be more costly for everyone, and would solve problems for very few.

Make the sticker bigger.. I doubt the original poster is stuck on it being a plate, but more interested in some way that it's easier to identify and report who the person was.

[mr_opjones]

On a boat you are required to put your own numbers on the boat so they are visible by others, no extra cost there.

[Critter7r]

On a boat you are required to put your own numbers on the boat so they are visible by others, no extra cost there.

Specifically, the OP's linked article mentioned making a plate, as opposed to the current sticker. And although a larger sticker might not be a bad idea, I also got the impression that the author found the horizontal mounting of the sticker to be a poor choice, so I assume (i know, I know) that the author would prefer some sort of a vertical mounting similar to street bikes.

[mr_opjones]

You focused on a plate, I realized he just wants a way to identify an ATV.

[Critter7r]

I got the gist of it. I just feel that ID'ing the ATV is already as good as it's going to get, since there isn't enough real-estate on an ATV for boat-style number IDs, and a full-on auto- or cycle-sized plate will as likely as not be covered in mud. Not to mention the very small pool of people requesting and benefitting from such a change.

Sure it'd be nice to get the plate number of some jack-hole that scared away all the rabbits when my son and I were out hunting, but really, what's it going to accomplish? Said jack-hole gets a $50 (or $100 or $1,000, whatever it is) fine for riding on a non-motorized trail? Well, my hunt is still ruined. I guess my point overall was simply that I don't feel the cost and hassle is worth all the trouble of re-making everyone's ATV ID, that's all.

[mr_opjones]

I just feel that ID'ing the ATV is already as good as it's going to get

It's not even close because I couldn't positively identify an ATV standing a foot away from it besides saying "it's a red 400ex".

since there isn't enough real-estate on an ATV for boat-style number IDs

*beep*, if they only had fenders, or number plates.

and a full-on auto- or cycle-sized plate will as likely as not be covered in mud.

I was not aware that the only time you can ride an atv is right after a rain in full on mud.

Not to mention the very small pool of people requesting and benefitting from such a change.

Everyone benefits from it because we can identify a criminal

Sure it'd be nice to get the plate number of some jack-hole that scared away all the rabbits when my son and I were out hunting, but really, what's it going to accomplish?

That jackhole won't do it again if they want to keep their atv after been talked to by law enforcement

Said jack-hole gets a $50 (or $100 or $1,000, whatever it is) fine for riding on a non-motorized trail? Well, my hunt is still ruined.

See above

I guess my point overall was simply that I don't feel the cost and hassle is worth all the trouble of re-making everyone's ATV ID, that's all.

No or minimal cost to the state if you are required to put a registration i.d. on your atv

[Critter7r]

It's not even close because I couldn't positively identify an ATV standing a foot away from it besides saying "it's a red 400ex".

I hope you don't think that I'm being a jock-hole myself during our little exhange here. I don't mind debating points, as long as no feelings are hurt. We obviously disagree on the ATV ID issue, so I hope you're ok with friendly banter.

That being said...

You said that you stopped and chatted with the offending ATV'ers, I'd think that wouldn't be the rule, rather the exception. Also, (and this may bolster your side of the debate, but) many people wouldn't even have known that it was a 400 anything, or even if were a Honda. Red might be as far as they got.

*beep*, if they only had fenders, or number plates.

Meh... the fenders are horizontal. Number plates are in the front and only about a foot wide, which STILL not enough room for boat-style numbers, but I guess could be fitted with a large sized ORV number, but the fender numbers wouldn't be visible from very far away. (I'm thinking 20-30 feet, max).

I was not aware that the only time you can ride an atv is right after a rain in full on mud.

many people don't bother washing after every muddy ride, and every muddy ride isn't necessarily a mud-fest, a little coating of mud would be all it takes.

Everyone benefits from it because we can identify a criminal.

While technically, riding an ATV on a non-motorized trail isn't "legal", I'd hardly classify it as a crime. Or, if I did, I'd classify it in the same category as speeding 5 over on the freeway. Technically illegal, but really, what's the harm?

That jackhole won't do it again if they want to keep their atv after been talked to by law enforcement

See above

No or minimal cost to the state if you are required to put a registration i.d. on your atv

i obviously have less of a problem in my area with the sorts of things that you experienced, and so I think I lean more toward it not being as big a deal as you feel it is. Which is ok... I'm not bagging on your passion for this at all. Besides, I love a good argument, just ask my wife!

[cramer]

While technically, riding an ATV on a non-motorized trail isn't "legal", I'd hardly classify it as a crime. Or, if I did, I'd classify it in the same category as speeding 5 over on the freeway. Technically illegal, but really, what's the harm?

What's the harm? I just saw the "harm" today while out riding a small section of trail. A quad got back there and tore the *beep* out of it. *beep* assholes. I would classify it as a hanging offense if it were up to me.

[Critter7r]

Unfortunately, ATVs tearing up the trails is a fact of life at the trails I ride, although it's not really that bad. They're designated as mountainbiking trails, but I don't think that motorized vehicles are actually forbidden. It's also a State Park that allows hunting, and hunters use ATVs to get to their blinds. And except for an occasional reroute of (or, more accruately, an addition to) the trail around a tree thicket, the ATVs in my area don't actually tear up the trails too much.

[KLydesdale]

Unfortunately, ATVs tearing up the trails is a fact of life at the trails I ride, although it's not really that bad. They're designated as mountainbiking trails, but I don't think that motorized vehicles are actually forbidden. It's also a State Park that allows hunting, and hunters use ATVs to get to their blinds. And except for an occasional reroute of (or, more accruately, an addition to) the trail around a tree thicket, the ATVs in my area don't actually tear up the trails too much.

The following is copied from the Handbook of MI ORV Laws. Note the part that I put in bold:

What Is an Off-Road Vehicle (ORV)?
Michigan law defines an ORV as any motor vehicle that can be operated cross-country (without benefit of a road or trail) over land, snow, and other natural terrain. This includes multi-track or multi-wheel vehicles; all-terrain vehicles (ATVs); motorcycles or related multi-wheel vehicles; amphibious machines (water-to-land and back); hovercrafts; and other vehicles that use mechanical power, including 2- or 4-wheel-drive vehicles that are highway registered but operated off highways or off roads.



It's the Law—Land Use Rules
ORV Operation on State-Owned Lands

State Forest Lands: ORV restrictions vary by location.

Upper Peninsula: ORV operation is permitted on designated trails and forest roads in the Upper Peninsula unless posted closed.
Lower Peninsula: ORV operation is permitted on all designated trails, designated areas, and designated routes (forest roads that are designated for ORV use) in the Lower Peninsula.
Statewide: ORV use on designated trails is limited to vehicles with an overall width of less than 50 inches. Off-trail or off-route operation outside of a designated area is prohibited except for hunters operating an ORV at speeds of 5?mph or less for the purpose of removing deer, bear, or elk.
State Game Areas: All motorized vehicle operation is prohibited except on established roads open to the public. ORVs are specifically prohibited. These areas are found primarily in the southern third of Michigan.

State Parks and State Recreation Areas: ORV operation is prohibited in all state parks and recreation areas except in designated areas of Silver Lake State Park

[Critter7r]

Wow.... was not aware of that. Obviously, neither are the several ATV users that visit Holdridge in the fall.

I wonder if there are "No Motorized Vehicles" signs that I don't remember or notice there. I'll have to pay attention when I get out to Holdridge when things dry out a bit.